I haven't included here the ranting that continued after I shut the convo down by blocking Lisa and the brief convo she had with a trans-ally follower of mine where she suddenly decides that we all want to shove puberty blockers hormones into three year olds. I'll deal with all that in part two of my response.
That Lisa Muggeridge Rant in full
LaughingNoam:
At
age 11 I had no idea what I should be studying
and yet was certain about my
gender.
There is difference between recognising your child
struggling with gender and giving permission or major treatment
LaughingNoam:
A trans
child can be identified at 4 to 6 and treatment won’t be
required till
adolescence – really no need for a panic!!!
Lisa M.
If R struggled with her gender, she would be supported but
I would not give permission for that treatment until she was adult
LNoam
Wait
until you are in that situation – I suspect you would
end up doing whatever was
right for your child
Lisa M. A trans child can identify themselves at any age
and would eb supported. The issue is what adolescence is.
LNoam
Would be medically defined – I wish I never had
to go
through a male adolescence and hope no other trans woman has to.
If we’re talking about cruelty – forcing a trans kid
to be a
gender they don’t identify as is off the scale. Life destroying
People are panicking – the key to treating dysphoria
effectively
is to intervene before adulthood
Not talking about gender issues im talking about trans.
You
can’t fudge that. You have to deal with it or take consequences
LisaM
you were discussing treatment. Adolescence is a hormonal
mess.
It woulng be a panic if a kid had gender issues. Justa thing
We are not talking about cruelty we are talking about
adolescence and adolescence is complicated
and not giving an adolescent already in the midst of
hormonal turmoil hormonal treatment is not a forcing a child anything
And am not ‘fudging’ gender issue and trans because the
definition of trans in recent years has been as reduced to ‘I now say
I am this so I am. That is not sufficient to give a young
person in the midst of adolescence hormone treatment
A child being loved and supported to live as who
they are is
not the same as that. At all.
L.Noam
When
the child starts changing into an adult during
adolescence they won’t be able
to live as themselves anymore
You
do know I have lived this and been a trans child
– what makes you think you
know better?
LisaM
Because you also say that if someone says they are a woman
then that is that. And its about female brains. Its bullshit.
Gender dysphoria must be awful. Being trans must be a
fucking
nightmare. You seem happy enough. I can’t be arsed with this
self righteous utter fucking gobbledygook. There are no lady
brains.
There is the female body. You let children be who they are
perdio. And you accept that children change who they are
throughout their childhood and adolescence. That’s how I know better
am really sorry, but reality does not change because you
learned
ideology on twitter and you being a trans women doesn’t
actually change the world for everyone else. Just you.
Its
not that important to everyone else. Woman. The rest of this is
twitter bullshit and I for one am not even remotely
interested.
I would not give a 12 year old that treatment for the same
reason I would not give them a cigarette, a contraceptive pill
An ecstacy pill, or cosmetic surgery. Because they are
changing.
Rapidly. And need to be allowed to. Biology
you don’t let children interfere with their growth or make
those
decisions because they are children and they cant.
and they believe something one day and then not the next.
Nothing to do with fearing them being trans.
I like you. I’ll be honest with you I don’t care that you
are trans
either way. It doesn’t even register. But this is bullshit.
and it certainly doesn’t mean reality changed. Doesn’t mean
biology changed. Doesn’t mean anything to be honest.
you just mean people comfortable with their gender. It’s
not
actually an insult or a descriptor. It means someone have gender
dysphoria. Is like coming up with a descriptor for people
who don’t have a cold.
L.Noam
So you
buy into the its just “mutilation” line. That’s pretty vile.
bit
if they had any other medical issue you would let them
have drugs so why no
gender dysphoria
LisaM
Hormone treatment on an adolescent who is the midst
hormones
guiding their body changing. No. Your identity doesn’t
change that
Its not a line. Its reality
L.Noam
That’s
vile
LisaM
On no planet would I give permission for an adolescent to
have hormone treatment. That is an adults choice. Not a childs
A child can be supported in living as who they want and you
said earlier its not about hormone treatment. It clearly is
NO. Under no circumstances should an adolescent under 18 be
given hormone treatment because they say so. No sorry.
L.Noam
It’s
a medical treatment carried out for medical reasons
and children at that age do
know – I know this for a fact
LisaM
Saying
it is a fact does not make it a fact
L.Noam
I’m
very disappointed in you
LisaM
You
are dissappointed because reality doesn’t change because of your identity. Well
it doesn’t. Tough.
L.Noam
It means
the world to me and makes a big difference to the people I interact with and
especially my boy friend
LisaM
I’ll
stick to the fraser guidelies and gillick competence to decide when a child can
consent to medical treatment. Not twitter.
L.Noam
I cant
talk to you any more
LisaM
I know
you cant but that’s not because am wrong. That’s because am right
and later:
L.Noam in response to @1azylizzie
im glad its not just me - I had to stop reading her tweets at me were so upsetting
LisaM
omg are you triggered. Was it violent to hear reality. That is about you. NOt me.
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